businessmen have already flown out of the embattled capital. one businessman who did not fly the coupe, muhammad, an investment bankers who lives in cairo on the phone from there with me right now. can you hear me? >> yes, hello, geraldo. >> geraldo: well, me where you are and what the situation is out your window. >> i'm living in a suburb. it is one of the i would say more wealthy suburbs of egypt. nevertheless, we are in danger. i have been standing since 7:00 p.m. yesterday over my home protecting my two children and my wife and my other people. i live in a gated community.

we have 500-meters beneath us more than 500,000 people coming from shan'ty looting everything that is around. we have been standing since 7:00 p.m. yesterday protecting our homes. there are no police in sight. no police officers in sight. we are completely alone. standing alone. we are fighting. we are doing this on our own. we continue to do so. we will protect our families and i'm telling everyone they are protecting their families, do not stop. they will not stop us this way. they are putting us in a situation where i have to choose between my -- and the security of my family. i will have both. this is my country. it is not their country. i will not flee this country. i will not leave this country. they cannot drive me out of my home. they cannot drive me out of my country. i own this place. it is not owned by hosni mubarak.

it is not owned by any one else. it is owned by the 80 million egyptians. educated, wealthy, uneducated, poor, everyone here, muslim, christian. i have to say muslim and christians. we are standing side-by-side fighting the regime. we will protect ourself. they have put the security and all of the forms of security needed have disappeared. there are no police officers in the state and i can tell you i have lived in this country for my entire life and i know what kind of police are there and i know that they can control things but they are punishing the egyptian people for asking for their people. >> geraldo: muhammad, good luck to you. stay safe. >> thank you. >> all. >> geraldo: although i appreciate your courage. we will briefly talk to some of the demonstrators here. have you spoken to your family? >> my sister is stuck in egypt. she was supposed to come today but she has no way of getting back to america for now. >> are you fearful for her?

>> no, i mean she said she was fine when i called her three hours ago so. i guess i'm good with her. >> geraldo: good luck. >> geraldo: i actually spoke to my aunt over there. for the most part they are fine like the people can protect themselves over there. >> geraldo: let's hope so. >> they are trying and doing a good job at it for mow. tnow. to protect their homes and their families. they just want him out. that is what they want. it is not about the, you know, we want aid or we want this. >> geraldo: what about the government, do you want a radical government there? >> these people didn't go out chanting for a radical brotherhood. they didn't want the brotherhood. they just want h him out. >> geraldo: they just want mubarak out. good luck to all of them. >> the official most responsible for our response to in crisis in cairo is president obama himself. a senior administration official telling fox news it was mr. obama who decided to call mubarak last night and decided he should make a

statement after that conversation and he was intimately involved with crafting his statement, the president's statement last night. with more on who is doing what in washington, here is our james rosen. >> good evening. what we saw here today was a rotating cast of top civilian, military and intelligence officials gathering throughout the morning and early afternoon. the first session conducted while the president was away on a family outing lasted about two hours. the second session chaired by the president himself. we are told lasted just over one hour. adnistration officials appeared unimpressed with president mubarak's personnel announcement. one searor aide told fox news the issue is what is the egyptian government going to do. they said it will take times, days at a minimum before we can see what lies behind mubarak's response. officials said that the president reiterated our focus on opposing violence and calling for restraint. supporting universal rights and supporting concrete steps that advance political reform within egypt.

a high ranking egyptian diplomat told fox news he is unaware of any preparations by mubarak to resign or flee the country. rather, h his source said a political solution is in process. this official suggested strongly that mubarak will seek to finish his term which ends in october and that in the meantime, the still evolving cabinet will try to deliver "the necessary reforms that will take into account the sentiments on the street." speaking publicly for the obama administration today, and in the strongest terms yet from the u.s. side was the assistant secretary of state. he tweeted around 9:00 eastern time and i quote the egyptian government can't reshuffle the deck and then stand back. president mubarak's -- the u.s. urges those traveling to egypt and those u.s. citizens in egypt to exercise caution. >> geraldo: now, we have two different views from former

state department officials. james rubin joins me here live. great to see you here. >> is this thing going to hell in a hand basket or can we do anything to control it? >> it is going very badly right now. i think the absence of police and security services. the chaos that we read about and heard about all day is a new development and a troubling one and it is hard to know from here, i don't think anybody really knows to what extent the police are apride to g friday o on -- afraid to go on the street, to what extent the government is trying to as your last caller said, punish people for freedom. or make people want the government to take charge again. that is the feeling that they are opening prisons, there is a lot of rumors about that. very hard to know. what we know and what we really need to focus on in this country and the administration is that for a long time now decades the united states military and the egyptian military had a close

relationship. we trained together. we have done exercises together. we funded them over a billion dollars a year in american military assistance. they are the ones who are going to make the decision as to whether this is done peacefully or whether there is going to be a bloodbath. at some point, we don't know when, today, tomorrow, in the neck week there is going to be a moment when large numbers of protesters are confronted by military power. and i have no doubt that mubarak is staying because he believes that the top officer corps are committed to him. but what happens when -- >> geraldo: from the military himself. >> right. he is an air force officer. what happens when the orders arish issued. will they be followed? will military soldiers actually shoot. that is where we have the leverage and we should be using that. >> what do we want them to do. you are in charge now, anoint

you. what do you whisper in the commanding egyptiaian general's here? is it in the united states interest for the egyptian army to open fire on their own people? >> absolutely not. already we have seen reporters hold up to the world tear gas cansters with made in the usa on them that were used by police. the idea of american equipment and we really know that military equipment in egypt, a lot is paid for and provided by the united states, would be involved in a mass use of force against innocent largely or perhaps slightly aggressive protesters. that is why president obama is over and over again the one theme in a rather rocky last few days where they have gone back and forth, the one theme, the one threat has been no use of force. >> geraldo: have we in a sense prostituted ourselves to a

military dictatorship because it suits the foreign policy of the united states? >> that is a strong word, geraldo. but i put it this way. the administration over the past few days seems driven by fear. fear, on the one hand, that if mubarak falls, relations with the key arab figure would be lost. israel's peace partner would be lost. potential ally in a coalition against iran would be lost. we cannot walk away from those. we have been quiet about egyptian democracy and quiet when it comes to the blackdowns that have occurred on the lack of an opportunity for are people to have representative government. it is a tough call but if you have to make a tough call in the highest levels of government the way you make it is you say to yourself, okay,

if we are going to make a tough call let's make it on the side of something we know we believe in which is the right of people around world to have free and representative government. i don't think we will end up worse off for making that decision. >> geraldo: thank you very much. the former -- you worked for the clinton administration. let's go now to christian whiten, the senior advisor of the administration of george w. bush from the state department. you have the rebuttalle. go ahead, christian. >> geraldo, i understand there is a great deal of anxiety coming out of washington because that foreign policy establishment as represented not only by democrats from whom you just heard but also by a lot of republicans said what is happening would have been impossible, that we had a choice between supposedly friendly dictators like mubarak on one hand and islamists on the other hand. the muslim brotherhood. what we are seeing in egypt and what we saw in tunisia is not people calling for an iranian

style. but people agitating and motivated by angst and economics and malaise but tracing that back to an undepartment government. what we are seeing here is supposed to be impossible. we could see our own national security receive an enormous boon from this. >> you think it would be more like turkey rather than iran? >> yes, d i do. that is the goal. the muslim brotherhood so ho so far has sat this out, there has been some activity. their view is we will let this revolution happen and then take over through election. they are looking through an example that took place in gaza. u.s. policy right now is reaching out to the leaders of democratic protests and cultivating the relationships. we also ought to be sending straight messages to mubarak and the army and i'm not sure if judging from administration statements that that is happening yet. >> geraldo: no straight talk

yet? i don't know about that. christian, you stand by. despite the fact, ladies and gentlemen, we give egypt $1.3 billion a year in aid, do we really have nipaer to control the events in egypt right now?

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>> geraldo: continuing our live coverage now of the chaos in cairo and the other big historic cities, suez and alexandria in egypt and the threat that it is going to go places. too many places. judith miller here, former cairo bureau chief for the new york times. great to have you onboard to get your perspective. not the cairo you remember. >> it is not the cairo i remember. and the cairo that is -- >> geraldo: will it be iran or istanbul? >> we are all hoping there will be a smooth transition and i think it is looking more and

more inevitable there will be a transition from mubarak to something and someone and we are not quite sure yet. >> geraldo: do you credit the story that his family has left the country already? >> i heard that again and again but have get to see a london sighting. the bbc hasn't gone with it so i just don't know. there are lot of rumors at a moment like this so we have to be careful about getting it wrong. >> geraldo: stand by, please. let me go to our jennifer griffin in d.c. burning the midnight oil there? is the president trying his best to ride herd on this stampeding horse without reins? >> the pentagon officials are definitely burning the midnight oil. a senior u.s. defense official tells me tonight that the pentagon, however, has not been asked by the u.s. embassy to begin preparations to evacuate the 500 americans who work at the embassy. i'm told if a full-scale evacuation were requested or ordered there are 50,000 u.s.

citizens who would have to be air lifted out. officials pentagon officials will not discuss contingency planning or the movement of u.s. military assets but centcom is looking at contingencies and the only amphibious assault ship in the region, marines onboard would be in a position to help evacuate the u.s. embassy should they be ordered to do so and the uss enterprise, a navy aircraft carrier could be called upon. it left for the middle east in mid january and would have to pass through the suez canal en route to the arabian gulf, a trip that normally takes a month. >> we are a military so we plan. and we go through all sorts of contingencies but the key activity here that is really important is to exercise restraint and to do so both on our part but also on the part of our counterparts in the egyptian military. >> reporter: i think it is important to point out and remind viewers, geraldo, that the top officials from -- and

the top generals from the egyptian military stayed at the pentagon for four days after these protests broke out on tuesday. they clearly didn't feel in any rush to go home and mubarak does not look like he is going go quietly. >> geraldo: well, there is plenty of noise already. jennifer griffin at the pentagon. thank you very much. a republican presidential contender and key congressional democrat give us t

>> geraldo: with me now to discuss the unraveling of egypt and the implications for the united states two able and experienced hands. new york congressman anthony weiner, is democrat who characterized our recent move

towards stability by sitting by king, a rival. to my right, the former governor of mike huckabee. these are troubling times, governor. do you fear for your foreign policy in the mid east because of what is happening in egypt? >> it is one of the two book ends that surround israel with stable partners and partners who have been good allies. the security of israel is of great concern to me. i will be there all of this next week for the next ten days for about my 15th time. i'm pretty sure that the tension will be significant. but the destablization of egypt has implications not just in the middle east but across the globe but especially creates a very dangerous and precarious position for all of the middle east specifically israel against the threat that comes from iran. >> geraldo: did we bring it on yourselves, congressman? >> destabilized, yes, but not for years.

for years mubarak has been unwell. we have to some degree been buying the problem for a time. egypt gets the same amount of aid that israel gets. egypt, military aid. year after year more and more military aid going to a country that yes, they are partner with israel for peace but problematic. their press more and more antisemitic all the time. the one surprise here is this did not come from the muslim brotherhood. this came from the average rank and file person yearning to be free and be treated better. i don't believe that keeping a dictator in place who is oppressing their people jeff works out in the best interests of the united states. ultimately if all of the arab countries all start to fall it is not such a terrible thing. as long as people have their aspirations lived up to, these

other issues will work themselves out in my view. >> geraldo: governor, the congressman is right. it didn't start with the muslim brotherhood. a secular spontaneous movement almost undeniably related to what happened in tunisia. the muslim brotherhood of professionals, they are deeply rooted and kind of waiting their chance to get the heel of mubarak's government off their necks. what happens now? >> the fact there is a growing sense and hunger for freedom and democracy is a good thing and almost like the soviets when there was a taste for beatles music and blue jeans once you have that you can't get rid of the technology that enables people to understand what is going on in the rest of the world by the internet has transformed. the question is what comes into the vacuum and that is the issue that we don't know and one that we can hopefully find out. if it is truly as you say, congressman, those folks

bubbling up from the bottom who just wants a chance to get their trash picked up and doesn't streets, that is one thing. if it turns out to be radical jihaddists, god help us all. >> geraldo: what do you think? >> it is hard to tell what is going on. seems like the governor knows the region so well. if you can envation wha envisit is going on you would -- it does seem what is going on on the arab street is perhaps something that was a long time in coming. people say we have the dictatororral rules but our lives are not good and we want them to be a little better. you look in all of the strife with the palestinians what is going on in ramallah with 15% growth because they are making moderate steps to having a moderate regime. the lesson that we learned here, is that ronald reagan -- it is hard for me to say this. ronald reagan said when cream have a chance to be free they

yearn to do it. in lebanon is as much about sui shia strife than anything else. the one thing we always learn too late is when the united states wraps its arm around whatever dictator in the name of stability we make a mistake. we should have higher aspirations. >> we have to be careful. we have given $3 billion a year to egypt. the congressman is right. it the primarily military aid. we thought he is a dictator but our dictator so that is good for us. may not be in the long-term we have to deal with antiamerican sentiment when, not if but when the mubarak government falls. >> it's going to happen. gentlemen, thank you. >> thank you. >> geraldo: stay tuned for the latest from here to over there as we try to make sense of the chaos in cairo. continuing live, after this.

if as we have repeatedly said we support the universal human rights of the egyptian people including the right to freedom of expression, of association and of assembly. we urge the egyptian authorities to allow peaceful protests and to reverse the unprecedented steps it has taken to cut off

communications. >> geraldo: secretary of state hillary clinton. that is ronnie khalil. an eegyptian american comedian. his dad is still in cairo. >> i actually have my entire are family in cairo and a lot of them in the area that the protests are going on. >> geraldo: are they confronting the looters roaming the streets? are they part of the vigilante movement that has sprung up. i wouldn't even want to call it that. people protecting their homes. >> i wouldn't want to call it vigilante movement either. i spoke to a bunch of friends and family members. some are staying at home and some are in the streets voicing their opinions hopefully very safely. i told them i would be on the show and a lot of them wanted me to voice there is a sort of belief that the muslim brotherhood has taken root or is behind all this and they are saying that is completely not the case. it is a lot of people from across-the-board but a lot of working class people, college educated people and, you know, this is so much talk about, you

know who the egyptians are going to choose when they have the choice. someone is a great leader or american ally or may not be as long an american ally. i think the important thing is that they actually get a choice and that is the beginning of democracy. in this country times you get the people that you want, sometimes you don't but at least you took a part in the political process. >> geraldo: why are you so sure that it won't be the muslim brotherhood? >> because i know the egyptian people. and the egyptian people are a very kind and caring people and have a great sense of humor. right now, look at them. they want freedom of expression. they want predo freedom to vot. >> geraldo: i hope you are right. that was the same description of the persian people in iran prior to 1979 and then the ayatollah came up and everything went to hell in a hand basket. do you think there is a generational difference? >> i think the younger generation is definitely fed

up. they are the people just graduating from colleges and universities and they were promised a better life and right now they are not experiencing it. it is definitely a younger movement. >> geraldo: an average annual income of $1,800 a year. >> yeah. >> geraldo: you can't live on that. >> it is difficult to live that way. it is virtually impossible. the thing is again the people who are taking the streets aren't just the poor people. it is across the board. a lot of my friends are upper income people and they are out there wanting the chaness to be chance to be free. >> i know you are comedian and i want you to come back and give us one of your jokes but regards to your family hopefully they are able too watch and good luck to you. thanks for being on. >> thank you. >> geraldo: judy miller formerly of the new york times, fox news contributor. you say it is impossible for the muslim brotherhood, the radical 10% to take over. >> i want to stop saying impossible but let's say very

difficult. one, they have never polled more than 20% in egypt. but two, there is still the military and the security factions. they are not going go away. >> geraldo: but there was a great army in iran also. >> but the army was sympathetic to the islamics. in egypt they are not sympathetic to them. >> geraldo: like turkey. >> they will fight to maintain the power of the state and their own poor and privileges and the $1.5 billion that they get from the united states. >> geraldo: a lot of billion dollars. are you surprised that israel has not yet really aggressively spoken out? >> no, i'm not surprised because the israelis are extremely is a shrewd and they know when i when to talk and wt to talk and at the moment anything they say is likely to complicate the situation so they have been silent which is something we might think a little more are about. >> geraldo: we will debate that more. let's go to jerusalem and leland who is there.

is it a fact that the government has been mum at least publicly? >> very much so, geraldo. in fact, we heard that prime minister netanyahu told all of his cabinet ministers to simply not speak to the media and as you know from covering stories in israel that is an extraordinarily rare occurrence that happened. unofficially and through sources we are hearing that israel is incredibly concerned about what is going on because of what they have seen happen in the past in the middle east. remember, there has never been a revolution in the middle east that brought in for a long-term some kind of liberal democratic government. it simply hasn't happened. very keen observer here on the ground in tehran in '79 said tehran in '79 sure looks a lot like cairo in 2011. folks are concerned. look at the huge green area there. that is is islamic states many of whom would like to push israel which is the tiny blue

sliver into the sea, in the mediterranean there. the only two friends, jordan and israel in th egypt in the . egypt, of course, is the first country that ever signed a peace treaty with israel back in the 1970s. a nwar sadat signing that was a historic moment. israel will rely heavily on egypt to try and secure the georgia da border with hamas to try and stop the flow of weapons. they already is relying on president mubarak to try and broker a peace deal with the palestinians and that certainly had a lot of weight on the arab street that you have that peace deal being brokered by the president of egypt. back here in jerusalem, we are hearing a lot of different things. the most interesting perhapses is that israel has evacuated some of the diplomatic families

from their mission there in cairo. they have not evacuated the ambassador or the rest of h his staff. right now israel has three things going for it that they are hoping say this way. number one the egyptian army is concerned with trying to keep peace inside egypt. the peninsula that offers a huge buffer zone and number three, perhaps the most importantly the egyptian streak has not yet turned antiisrael. remember, we have not seen one picture of a burning israeli flag which in the middle east is a very interesting thing not to see in a protest. >> geraldo: thank you. good job. ambassador ned walker, former ambassador, our former ambassador to egypt. what is your response to the israeli situation and the whole muslim brotherhood possibility? >> the muslim brotherhood is not that strong in egypt. it is fractured.

it has absolutely got no leadership. talk about iran. ayatollah k could mess mercedes rise home. there is no equivalent in the muslim brotherhood in egypt. it may be a part of a new parliament or a political landscape. it is not going to take over. i think this is a cue national guard. cunard. mubarak always tried to contend this is the great risk. i think it is time to say we will support egypt and the egyptian people and it is time for mubarak to go. >> geraldo: whawalid phares, we is the revolution coming next? >> basically if things go bad in egypt that is followed by fractures inside the armed forces in a sort of advance of the muslim brotherhood, then the network, the jihady network

in the region will be encouraged. if you don't develop strategies for egypt the chain of events is going to be each group will try to go to their direction. press mubarak will use the army and street forces to stay. that would prompt the majority of demonstrators to continue to demonstrate. that would lead to looting and that would basically lead to the muslim brotherhood start saying we are the ones who can defend the neighborhood so the muslim brotherhood three weeks from now they will look different than the muslim brotherhood of today. >> geraldo: interesting point. we could fuel the monster that we fear the most. gentlemen and lady, please stand by. they cut off the internet in egypt. is this a prelude to the way wheres will be waged in the future?

>> geraldo: back live, everybody. the president of the united states and many others in this country and civil libertarians across the planet are extremely critical of egypt for shutting off the internet in egypt. they shut off the social networks, facebook, twitter, all of them. just shut them down. no more instant messaging on blackberry and all the rest of it. shut them down cold. i think however hideous that may have been that is run of the reasons the crowd shrunk on the streets of cairo. young people could no longer use social media to rally their

forces. here is our peter docy wit dooh the details. >> most egyptian homes, banks and businesses remain offline after president obama said this. >> i call on the egyptian president to reverse the actions that they have taken with interference to the internet and cell phone service and social networks that do so much to connect people in the 21st century. >> and this graphic gives you an eye ke idea of how fast intt activity fell off. there was almost no online activity for quite awhile. some ever using dialup modems and land lines and satellite phones to send pictures from the streets of cairo to the rest of the world. even with a total communication shutdown the government could not keep a lid on its unhappy population for long.

a photo posted on twitter of the tahrir square. many had mobile phone service disabled for 24 hours and the private sector complied with the government shutdown. british company vodafone wrote they restored voice services to the customers in egypt this morning as soon as we were able. we would like to make it clear that the authorities in egypt have the technical capability to close our network and if they had done so is t. would have taken longer to restore services to our customers. it has been clear there were no legal or practical options open to any of the mobile operators in egypt you to comply with the demands of the authorities. and geraldo, we are looking for more first hand accounts from the protests as egyptians continue to find new ways to share their stories. back to you. >> geraldo: thanks. judy miller on the left. former bureau chief of the new

york times. christian, a former state department official on the right. judy, you first. where next? tunisia first. egypt second. is there a next? >> i think i would worry about jordan. >> geraldo: jordan? >> wouldn't have happened under the father, king hussein. the son is some what weaker and the economy is much worse and there are a lot of angry palestinians in that country. >> geraldo: probably more palestinians than jordannians in jordan. >> there are. >> christian whiten, former state department official. in the george w. bush administration. what do you think? who is next? >> i'm not sure there is a next. i would like very much for there to be one. >> geraldo: you would like there to be one? >> another -- i would like to see democracy spread throughout the middle east into other oppressive states especially iran and saudi arabia which the repex causes a great deal of

harm for us. i don't think we are at a berlin wall moment yet. >> you don't think this is one of those pivot points in history, christian? >> i wish it were. it is really significant what is going on and caught washington completely by surprise i think. we have waged political and economic warfare against the soviet union and the eastern bloc for decades and we knew the enemy and identified it and knew who our friends were. the shift workers a dissidents. we haved accomplished any of that in regards to the auto crates or islamists. >> because it was in our interest not to. we are on the other sided now. >> hopefully the lie has been exposd that we no longer need to be supporting the military dictatorships because there is a other way consistent with our democratic values. >> geraldo: christian, hold on. is that naive? >> i hope you are right but the history does not tell us that that is the way this may end. i think we are going to have to

be very lucky and have if there is a smooth transition i'm not sure how tunisia will come out. i still think we have to worry. i don't want to see any more. this is for awhile. >> geraldo: i don't know how you put this genie back in the bottle. i would like it to happen. the auto crattic regimes give me the wilies. would i rather have the auto crat or the islamic radical democracy. that is a question that keeps me up at night.

>> geraldo: that is craig to your left. he is at st. george coptic church in jersey city. plenty of christians in egypt and many feeling bevy leaguered

as the con gratitude grants in that church are about to tell craig and you after a suicide attack in january killed two and wounded nine others. let's hear from some of the folks at st. georges. >> a lot of these kids are staying in touch with friends and relatives over in egypt or were until the revolution by via social network. i'm with marie a and marina. they were getting minute-by-minute updates until it went down. tell us what your relatives were saying. >> things going to get crazy or hectic. updates about friends in the protest. pray for us. things are bad. pray for us. >> did they want this to happen? >> they wanted freedom. they wanted change. i don't know if they envisioned this specifically. >> went a little further than they expected. what about you.

what do you want to see happen to your relatives in egypt? >> i want them to live the same way i live. i want to come out and go to church without worrying something will happen to me and i can act myself without getting judged. >> freedom of religion is all they want. back to you. >> geraldo: give them our thoughts and prayer as well. walid, where do we go from here? >> i would suggest strongly two strategies. one is to separate the regime of mubarak from the egyptian state. engage with the army and bureaucrats and foreign policy people and try to have an exit for press mubarak. on the other hand, separate the majority of the demonstrators from the radicals and muslim brotherhood and other radicals and engage them as soon as you can. the student movements. and that way you can have a new government and then a new

society together. >> geraldo: judy miller, final thoughts? >> i agree. i think what the united states does now in the next 48 hours is going to be crucial. what the crowds do will be crucial. i don't think that the egyptian people have really had a chance to speak about what they want and i just hope they get a chance to do that. >> geraldo: ambassador walker, does a secular egypt an inclusive multireligious egypt survive? >> of course, it does. the basic issue is how mubarak leaves the scene. you were talking about or asking about where next. well, you start to look around, the arab world, i would say look at places like syria where you have a minority that is suppressing a majority and you have a regime which is repressive. so, egypt will survive. it has survived 5,000 years and it will continue.

>> geraldo: agree with that. syria would be a place i would cheer on for are a jazz minute revolution. final thoughts? >> christian, you there? >> mubarak at his time, it is time to leave. tell the army to continue not to make war on its own people. we can partner with them and also work reach out directly to democrats here to make sure the islamics don't ever get the upper hand. an overwhelmingly positive development and could be a positive development for our own international security as well. >> geraldo: here is my editorial. mubarak, get out and let the army take over for the time being and then have a transition to an inclusive secular democracy. that should be american policy. i'm sure they are listening to

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